Everyday Stranger

Helen, you are fare more patient than I am, and I am famous for my rocking horse patience around here! Those little critters would have heard my Raised Voice From Hell after the episode with the golf clubs, and would have left the house, willingly or not, with or without their parents, I don't care, when they started going through my stuff. That is NOT acceptable behaviour.

I can't understand the no-spanking laws (Germany has something similar, sadly). I understand where they're coming from (preventing child abuse), but as others have remarked, reasoning is just not very effective for very young and/or bratty and misbehaved kids...

Melanie-it's about -13 today, and was that day, too. But I think the little hellions are adaptable for most environs!

how cold is it there? I'd have shut them outside for ten minutes. then say behave or you'll be out til your folks go home.

I agree that kids are too coddled these days, but that just seemed like bad parenting. They should have grabbed those kids by the arm and told them to sit the heck down.

ack, see i have the chipmunk cheeks but not the lips (like you do!) for lipstick. i look just god awful in the stuff. which is perhaps part of the reason i get mistaken for a 17 year old half the time! lol... guess i'll just have to let people think i have the mumps or that i'm storing acorns for the winter. ;-)

Yes Serenity,

Still smiling at the "Pick up the pieces of your shattered life and move on." bit:)

Jim of "Just wait"

Are you the Jim of Snooze Button Dreams? If so, your "just wait" is not a threat. Reading about you and your family swings the balance in favor of having a family:)

I spent saturday upstairs holding my dear puppy as my wife visited downstairs with her friend...and two of her kids. One was afraid of dogs, including sweet ones apparently, so I had to confine the puppy. It wasn't only that, but the kids ran around and screamed like banshees.

I visited blogs and held my tongue. My puppy cried. I wanted to go medieval on some bratty ass. But no, I kept quiet, except for the time I was asked if my puppy dog was bothering me two much and I responded "oh, she's bothering me but at least I still have my eardrums."

I always say the wrong things at the wrong time...

Oi Vey...friends or not, if I had company over that had kids that terrorized my pets and went through my private things, they would be booted out the door and never invited back. I don't give a whit if you don't hit your kids in Sweden, it is not an excuse to allow them to run around like idiots and act so rudely.

Btb: Perhaps I'm not supposed to laugh but what your sister used to say to your mother:

"Pick up the pieces of your shattered life and move on."

Made me laugh so hard. I love that kind of humor.

Good luck on the job!

"My kids will never be like that."

just wait.

And Kat-you betcha lipstick on Christmas morning! I am a lipstick girl, and knew that family would be snaps happy. When you have a big round chipmunk face like mine, you need a big of color to convince people you don't have the mumps:)

Looking forward to some artwork, darlin'...

I agree, Roger-had they sat down on the floor with their hands out and spent all their time trying to coax my pets (who generally need no coaxing as they are in-your-face loving), then I would've given them all the raisins they could carry.

I think we will take Kaetchen's man's son and clone him. He sounds perfect.

Wow Helen,

Your much more of a social and generous person than I would be. Hasse and Annika would have been given their marching orders, I wouldn't care how much their "feelings" got hurt. Can they say, "The Moxley Murder"?

We can tell a lot about adults/children by how they treat animals. What some people try to keep hidden about their character shows when they interact with defenseless creatures.

There is nothing better to see than a child/adult tirelessly coax your/any cat(s) to trust them and not betray the trust when the cat decides to cozy up to them.

Best to you for 2004 and as far as employment I'm not worried; you've got skills and drive.

good luck with the uk job! i've got my fingers and toes crossed.

wow, just reading about those thugs, gave me a headache. i'm not a "spanker," but really there's no excuse for letting your kids run amuck like that in someone else's house! oy!

oh, and i love all the christmas picks. but you put lipstick on for opening presents? i'm never looking good christmas morning, we all look wild and wooly. i think that's part of our tradition though. however, i love the jammies! :-)

I'm still in awe of Scratcher's son, who will be 9 next month and *does exactly what you ask him to do*. Not in a kiss-ass way; he was just brought up to respect adults. My jaw dropped the first time we went into a toy store together - he asked for something, was told "no", and said, "okay, dad". Let's clone him at different ages and replace your friends' horrid threesome. Eek.

Kids these days.. spoiled brats... anyway Helen, uninsatll java runtime 2.0 and see if that works for you. Look for it in your add/remove programs.

As they get older, reasoning is more effective; but one can't always reason (nor should they try) very well with a child under 3 or 4. My grandma used to say, "You can't put an adult head on a child." Grandmas are so wise.

And as unpopular as it may sound, "Because I said so" is an appropriate responce to children of all ages.

Pretty sure I never want children. Truth of the matter is I enjoy not being responsible for little ones who will drain money away from my early retirement plans.

Besides dont we have enough little people running around the world?

PaulUSA, darlin'-I still have more of the Helen World Tour to do :)

The alternative to spanking here in Sweden is to reason with them. I have seen half-hearted efforts at time-outs and such, but in general the kids have the tantrums, do what they want, etc. The kids are not spanked here. What can I say, there's no such thing as "life in prison" here either.

I'm not saying I'm against it, I can see the usage of corporal punishment (and to be honest if I had kids in Sweden I imagine that number is going to be called on me), but ONLY to be administered carefully and in the right situations. Kid screaming unnecessisarily in the shop? A short smack on the bottom can fix it. Children should NEVER be hit in the face, nor should they EVER be hit with objects (belts, branches, etc). I don't think a spanking is the answer to everything, I think that there are other options of discipline (grounding, time-outs, going to bed immediately after dinner, etc).

I also think it depends on the child. To punish me, my mother used to simply need to say: "I'm very disappointed in you", and I would crumble like a tower of cards and totally behave. My sister's reaction to my mother saying that? "Pick up the pieces of your shattered life and move on."

Then what the hell do I know-I only have a dog (who gets put in time-out now, instead of the spankings he got as a puppy. This only because time-outs are way more effective on my very social dog).

H,
Not offering the "permissive units" more coffee doesn't make you a bad hostess. If you had poured coffee ON the thugs/children then maybe... how hot was it?

Tel Aviv?! Uh dear, that's not Chicago! That just won't do! Best of luck anyway. *sniff*

PC

Helen,

Joking? No. Tongue in cheek? Yes. I believe in lovingly and judiciously spanking children. A parent HAS to have instant obedience from his/her children, and spanking is one of the ways to get it from younger children.

Why instant obedience? My two daughters and I were crossing a street with a median in the middle. I had my hands full and couldn't hold theirs. I said, "Let's go half way across and stop", because traffic had stopped in one direction only. Both took off running. I yelled stop and Angel1 (9 years old) stopped immediately in the median, but Angel2 (my 6 year old) didn't. Fortunately, the oncoming driver was driving defensively and didn't hit her.

When Angel1 was 2, she was getting ready to put a metal object in an electric socket (we were at a friend's house that wasn't "child proof"), and I said, "Angel1, No!", and she stopped immediately. Thug or Thug Junior may have continued and been electricuted.

What if the driver had been changing a cd and not paying attention? My daughter's lack of obedience would have cost her her life. If my older daughter had disobeyed, she may have been electricuted and possibly killed. People think they will get their children's respect and obedience when they're old enough to reason, but often they just get older rebellion.

So I don't really believe in spanking the live long day, but I do believe in lovingly and judiciously spanking a child. And if they rebelliously disobeyed multiple times a day, they got multiple spankings a day, but those were few and far between. And now they almost never get them. Angel1 hasn't had one in more than a year, and I can't remember the last time Angel2 got one. And both are incredibly loving, considerate, and kind-hearted children.

What do you think?

I hope Solomon is not joking - I love the reasoning.

And I want to hear what the alternative idea is if spanking is illegal.

I have two teenagers and they have never acted that way. I have only spanked them once or twice and usually my 'evil eye' does the trick. When faced with children who run-amuck in your house, it is perfectly alright to promise to flush them down the toilet if their behavior does not turn around immediately....the parents will get the message. If the bad behavior continues, then boot all their asses out of your house.

Er...Solomon? You are joking, yes?

As the mother of a toddler, I must say that there are certain situations that spanking isn't a bad thing. I know that as a child, I was not a child that "time-outs" worked on in any way, shape or form. And my daughter seems to have the exact same attitude. Spanking is not a bad thing. Abuse is, but they are completely different things.
Oh, and I'm thinking REALLY good thoughts for the UK job for you. I really hope you get it!

Helen,

"Spank early; spank often" is my motto; and I have two incredibly adorable, loving, parent-honoring, well adjusted, and sweet daughters (9 and 6 years old).

"So you hit children to teach them not to hit?", one might say. "ABSOLUTELY!!", I respond. Authorities speed to catch speeders (if you have speed limits), imprison kidnappers, and confiscate stolen property. Authorities are accorded behavior their subordinates aren't. Spanking (not beating) is one such behavior for parents.

The younger the child, the more effective are spankings (Plus they can't call that phone number to turn you in); the older the child, the more effective is reasoning.

I have an idea I'll post if spanking is against the law where you live. Go Georgia!!

I can't believe your friends, the parents of the thugs from hell, allowed them to behave that way in your home.
When my son was small, he had a thuggish friend with parents just like that, and when he came to my house, he sat in the corner if he misbehaved - didn't matter if his idiot parents were there or not. He learned to behave when I was around. I remember him calling his mother a bitch - he was 5 years old. She said " Bradley, that's not nice", and he said it over and over and over.

Good luck with the job, as someone who is job hunting in the UK myself i know how hard it is.

As for the hair, you cutie!

As for the kids and Partner Units recent behaviour? Yuk!

Abs x

You surely do have a penchant for naming ppl..

The Thug, Thug Junior and Thug Lite!!
lol

All the best for the job! You really deserve a decnt break, am sending very positive signals to the powers that be to turn the tides in your favour.

Ah! No wonder you've been so quiet! Now, I know you visit atleast!

As for brats, most kids are not innocent angels at all but manipulative brats who know how to get what they want. I was raised like you to be seen and not heard and I hope my kids will be well-behaved. I shudder sometimes when I see some kids these days. Most are devils and their parents do nothing about it at all.

Oh my, sounds like you had quite the time with small children! My parents have a store that sells toys. When i'm home to visit i often work for them and it has made me reconsider having children on more than one occassion. The tantrums thrown when a "no" is heard are ridiculous! But i must agree with Jim that it has to do with parents doing anything to stop it. I cringe when these tantrums are pacified by the purchase of the toy that the child was screaming over. I also agree that my children will never be like that :)

Good luck on the job!!!

And congrats on cutting your hair! It looks fabulous!

This is a new one, I am still waiting for the interview for that other one (the other one I have a 50% shot at. This one may be harder to get, but sounds great).

Weirdly enough, looks like I could get a contract with Company X in Tel Aviv now...weird.

Here in Georgia, corporal punishment is actually mandated by law. For exactly such an emergency, I expect.

That's not a question of smacking the kids or not, it's a problem with the parents. You didn't mention even once that the parents tried to do any single thing to correct the kids' behavior and bad actions.

Bad hostess? Fuck that, they were lowsy guests. If they are close friends then let them know they are always welcome back whenever they have babysitters for the kids but those children will never be welcome in your house again. Sound rude? It's nothing compared to the rudeness they inflicted on your household.

Sending kick ass and take name wishes for the job. Good luck, Helen! (When will you know? Is this the same one that wanted to interview just before Christmas?)

Good luck with the job.

As to those kids, they sound like little monsters who deserve a good smack, phone number or not. Sometimes, admittedly as a final resort, but sometimes the only way to get a message across to a kid is forcefully. Kids only know about limits and how to push them; they keep pushing until they get to a point where the costs outway the benefits. Reasoning with them isn't a cost they care about.